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Not sure where else to put this question. Just wondering if the PTC display overrides the requirement to run prepared to stop and actually observe the next signal when delayed in the block?

I don’t believe it does. On the Bangor camera, Amtrak always seems to creep west after they’ve made their station stop until the next signal can be seen (WAS EE Gross). Then again, maybe I’m just imagining that?

From what I've heard, most railroads did not elect to install "vital" PTC and thus it cannot strictly function as a cab signal system, even if it usually gives a pretty good forecast for train crews. Thus, they must still follow DIB rules.

Not sure if I have it 100% correct, but that is my current understanding. ITCS is "vital" and lets them do some additional things, not sure if Amtrak has dropped DIB tho.

Thanks, guys! That's what I was thinking, but I'm out of the loop on this newer technology. (Remember: I'm from the flimsys and carbon paper era!). I've been watching that VRF camera in La Plata, MO and it came up in the chat. WB's often wait there between signals, and the next signal is around a curve once they start moving, and people keep asking why they are "going so slow." (Actually, they seem to think anything less than 70 MPH is "slow!")

C&O Dispatcher wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 19, 2021 1:11 pm

Thanks, guys! That's what I was thinking, but I'm out of the loop on this newer technology. (Remember: I'm from the flimsys and carbon paper era!). I've been watching that VRF camera in La Plata, MO and it came up in the chat. WB's often wait there between signals, and the next signal is around a curve once they start moving, and people keep asking why they are "going so slow." (Actually, they seem to think anything less than 70 MPH is "slow!")

The PTC is definitely helpful with regard to knowing ahead of time whether you've got greens or approaches coming up, so it works well with holding out until you get your light.

PTC has made a lot of crappy engineers look a lot better in recent years, but there is definitely something to be said about leaning too much on it as a crutch. There are legitimate concerns about what happens if an engineer has to cut PTC out, with regard to his habits. How will they hold up when they no longer can see multiple signals ahead, see the grade, are told where to start slowing down, etc? Most will obviously handle it just fine, but in the process of closing one hole in the NTSB's "swiss cheese" another has opened up.

The other big hole is work limits and permission past signals. The train crews tell their PTC box when they're cleared through. Foreman and Dispatcher inputs for that are supposedly coming for "PTC 2.0" but lord only knows when that might finally arrive.

I once had a fellow colleague working in Form B (work zone) limits comment that PTC made it safer because it would automatically stop a train at the red boards. I detailed how the crew could, intentionally or not, tell PTC they're clear through the limits at maximum authorized speed, and then PTC wouldn't hold them back. He was a little more careful around the live track in Form B after that!

Can’t dispatchers already send bulletins to trains via PTC?

SD80MAC wrote: ↑

Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:27 pm

Can’t dispatchers already send bulletins to trains via PTC?

Yes

With ITCS active, the DIB rules are not in effect....

and people keep asking why they are "going so slow." (Actually, they seem to think anything less than 70 MPH is "slow!").....yeah C&O DS, I can relate, even 79 seems slow to me after running 110 for a while;-)

Buster Manning wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 10, 2021 9:57 pm

With ITCS active, the DIB rules are not in effect....

I can add at this point that DIB rules are not in effect under Wabtec's PTC on the South Shore, either