Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Anything pertaining to railfanning in Ohio.
User avatar
Jochs
Iron Horse Whisperer
Posts: 7279
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2010 4:52 pm
Location: On my laptop!

Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by Jochs »

Norfolk Southern had another derailment in Ohio today, this time in Springfield.
https://www.wdtn.com/news/train-derails ... ads-close/
Jeff O.
Celebrating 11 years dial-up free!

(18:36:45) MagnumForce: Railfanning is way more fun when you stop caring about locomotives and signals
(19:11:29) cbehr91: I can't believe I'm +1ing Brent but +1

User avatar
David Collins
Youtube Railfan Guru
Posts: 2759
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:46 am
Location: Bloomfield Hills, Mi
Contact:

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by David Collins »

In my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.

Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.

This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.

Rant over.
Last edited by David Collins on Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

redside20
i don't give a fark about your PM
Posts: 3513
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 11:44 am
Location: Columbus Ohio
Contact:

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by redside20 »

Gnarly dude! I dont live too far from there either. The cause is the one of the trucks of a wheelset came off the bottom of an autorack and derailed up to twenty cars. three tankers are involved but nothing has caught fire or exploded thankfully...full of benzene, denatured alchohol and something else.
Exit stage left

User avatar
~Z~
Sofa King Admin
Posts: 12908
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:14 pm
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Contact:

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by ~Z~ »

Webmaster
Railroad photos on Railroadfan.com

Mark F
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 302
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 4:47 pm
Location: Lowell MI

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by Mark F »

David Collins wrote:
Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:03 pm
In my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.

Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.

This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.

Rant over.
Other than the media's sudden intense scrutiny after discovering that railroads still exist, is there actually any statistical data supporting your assertion that derailments are occurring on a more frequent basis? If you're looking for government incompetence to solve corporate incompetence, you're probably going to be disappointed. Just ask Mayor Pete.

User avatar
Saturnalia
Authority on Cat
Posts: 15385
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:54 pm
Location: Michigan City, IN
Contact:

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by Saturnalia »

David Collins wrote:
Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:03 pm
In my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.

Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.

This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.

Rant over.
You could at least wait for a probable cause before freaking out.

You’d make a good mainstream media “journalist”.
Thornapple River Rail Series - YouTube
Safety today is your investment for tomorrow

User avatar
R Bedell
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 157
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 2:42 pm
Location: Mid Michigan

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by R Bedell »

In my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.
WOW...... :shock:

User avatar
Standard Railfan
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 1800
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 7:25 pm
Location: Marquette, MI

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by Standard Railfan »

A truck crashed in Maryland and caught fire. The driver died and the fire spread to six nearby houses and five automobiles. The news reports indicate the first responders do not know what the truck was hauling.

Where is the media on this one? Should trucking companies be banned from hauling hazmat? Should trucking companies be required to provide notice of hazmat traveling through each town?

https://news.maryland.gov/msp/2023/03/ ... ck-county/

PatAzo
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 1368
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 9:20 pm

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by PatAzo »

Shut NS down because they are a threat to public safety? Data shows something different. https://www.bts.gov/content/hazardous-m ... amage-data

In comparison to the 893 U.S rail fatalities in 2021 (with 617 of those being trespassers). 42,915 motor vehicles fatalities, 5,190 work place fatalities, 495 fatalities die to house fire (so far this year). 573 farming fatalities (2019).

Would understanding the root causes and taking appropriate action be prudent? Sure it would. Is there lower hanging fruit so to speak safety wise? Definitely.


Rail https://injuryfacts.nsc.org/home-and-co ... -injuries/
Highway https://www.nhtsa.gov/press-releases/ea ... fatalities
Work related https://www.bls.gov/iif/#:~:text=News%2 ... in%202020.
Home fire https://apps.usfa.fema.gov/civilian-fatalities/
Farming https://www.nifa.usda.gov/about-nifa/bl ... usly-known

User avatar
~Z~
Sofa King Admin
Posts: 12908
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:14 pm
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Contact:

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by ~Z~ »

Standard Railfan wrote:
Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:38 am
Where is the media on this one?
Washington Post: https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va ... county-md/

New York times: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/04/us/g ... =US%20News

I'd say the media is covering it. Google news search for "Maryland truck crash fire" has a lot of articles.
Also, just lollerskates at the idea of shutting down NS immediately.
Webmaster
Railroad photos on Railroadfan.com

User avatar
MrAnderson
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 86
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2020 1:44 pm

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by MrAnderson »

David Collins wrote:
Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:03 pm
In my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.

Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.

This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.

Rant over.
This would just send all the traffic to trucks. And I know you know that's worse.

Typhoon
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 1186
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 6:16 pm
Location: Under a palm tree

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by Typhoon »

David Collins wrote:
Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:03 pm
In my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.

Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.

This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.

Rant over.
Go back to Youtube and leave the railroading to the big boys.

chapmaja
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 1261
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:02 pm

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by chapmaja »

David Collins wrote:
Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:03 pm
In my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.

Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.

This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.

Rant over.
Nothing personal with this comment, but I think this is the absolutely dumbest thing I have read in a long time. Even if the FRA were to try shutting down NS, there would be so much pushback from so many people in so many high places it would never happen. One of the biggest threats facing this country right now is inflation. What do you think would happen if the FRA were to shut down NS. A substantial amount of production would cease due to the lack of ability to move raw materials and or products to an from manufacturing facilities. This would lead to substantial economic problems across the eastern United States where NS serves and for communities who rely on items shipped to or from NS captive companies.

In the event NS were to be shut down the first step companies would take is trying to find alternative transport options, meaning trucks. There is currently a substantial shortage of truck drivers across this country and even more so those with hazmat certifications. This will create a substantial bidding war for trucking services, drastically driving up costs throughout the economy, both for items directly impacted by transportation substitution, and for items that will now cost more to transport than they previously would have because drivers will need to be paid more to transport the same products.

This isn't like the government shutting down a single trucking company, where there is immediate access to the facility from other trucking companies. Even if the FRA were to shut down NS and authorize another company to provide service, those companies wouldn't be able to provide that service for a significant period of time (no qualified crews, no crews available, ect, ect,. ect. )

Does the FRA need to take a look at what is happening? Absoltuely, the FRA, and other government agencies should always be looking at incidents that happen and learn from them. What can't happen is knee jerk reactions undertaken without careful consideration of the consequences of an action, both intended and all potential unintended consequences.

chapmaja
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 1261
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:02 pm

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by chapmaja »

~Z~ wrote:
Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:31 pm
Video of it derailing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJ7O2JDtrwA
I am not an expert on railroad derailments, but to me this looks like it is intiated when the second of the three covered coil cars hits the edge of the crossingand appears to bounce. This would lead me to believe the cause was something with either the rail at this crossing or the wheels under this car. You see the apparent bounce and then everything starts rolling off the the near side of the tracks.

The only thing I would question is if the balance of loads vs empties and the length of this train (212 cars per the report I heard) may have had something to do with the incident, as the forces inolved in the train many have created additional forces on the train.

User avatar
Saturnalia
Authority on Cat
Posts: 15385
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:54 pm
Location: Michigan City, IN
Contact:

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by Saturnalia »

chapmaja wrote:
Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:24 pm
I am not an expert on railroad derailments, but to me this looks like it is intiated when the second of the three covered coil cars hits the edge of the crossingand appears to bounce. This would lead me to believe the cause was something with either the rail at this crossing or the wheels under this car. You see the apparent bounce and then everything starts rolling off the the near side of the tracks.
This is speculation, but I'm thinking that car was already on the ground, and the crossing finally finished it off by removing the car from the track and setting off the pileup.
Thornapple River Rail Series - YouTube
Safety today is your investment for tomorrow

BnOEngr
Captain Obvious
Posts: 352
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 8:41 am

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by BnOEngr »

About 8 cars before the derailment, you can hear a car with flat spots, then the slack runs in. My guess is there were loads on the rear and those coil cars popped out when the rear came in.

User avatar
R Bedell
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 157
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 2:42 pm
Location: Mid Michigan

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by R Bedell »

Nothing personal with this comment, but I think this is the absolutely dumbest thing I have read in a long time. Even if the FRA were to try shutting down NS, there would be so much pushback from so many people in so many high places it would never happen. One of the biggest threats facing this country right now is inflation. What do you think would happen if the FRA were to shut down NS. A substantial amount of production would cease due to the lack of ability to move raw materials and or products to an from manufacturing facilities. This would lead to substantial economic problems across the eastern United States where NS serves and for communities who rely on items shipped to or from NS captive companies.

In the event NS were to be shut down the first step companies would take is trying to find alternative transport options, meaning trucks. There is currently a substantial shortage of truck drivers across this country and even more so those with hazmat certifications. This will create a substantial bidding war for trucking services, drastically driving up costs throughout the economy, both for items directly impacted by transportation substitution, and for items that will now cost more to transport than they previously would have because drivers will need to be paid more to transport the same products.

This isn't like the government shutting down a single trucking company, where there is immediate access to the facility from other trucking companies. Even if the FRA were to shut down NS and authorize another company to provide service, those companies wouldn't be able to provide that service for a significant period of time (no qualified crews, no crews available, ect, ect,. ect. )

Does the FRA need to take a look at what is happening? Absoltuely, the FRA, and other government agencies should always be looking at incidents that happen and learn from them. What can't happen is knee jerk reactions undertaken without careful consideration of the consequences of an action, both intended and all potential unintended consequences.
AMEN, I was thinking the same thing.

User avatar
~Z~
Sofa King Admin
Posts: 12908
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:14 pm
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Contact:

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by ~Z~ »

Preview of how NS will start moving hazardous materials next month:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRB4ocyZSE8

Just kidding :)
Webmaster
Railroad photos on Railroadfan.com

User avatar
Standard Railfan
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 1800
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 7:25 pm
Location: Marquette, MI

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by Standard Railfan »

Norfolk Southern and AAR issue warning of loose wheels on certain coil steel cars.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/defective-lo ... d=97761704

Here is a link to the AAR document courtesy of Railway Age.
https://www.railwayage.com/wp-content/ ... visory.pdf

User avatar
redcrumbox
Railroadfan...fan
Posts: 160
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:39 pm

Re: Derailment in Springfield, OH Today.

Unread post by redcrumbox »

David Collins wrote:
Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:03 pm
In my opinion, the FRA needs to shut NS' operations down until they can make new safety practices that the FRA can agree upon, and if the regulator doesn't like it, nothing moves on that railroad until the regulator is satisfied.

Here's why: NS at this point is a threat to public safety with all of these relatively large derailments becoming more and more frequent, and some of these are happening in some relatively large towns/cities. Of course, let's not forget the people getting sick who live in East Palestine and surrounding areas.

This whole bit of corporate incompetence has gone too far, and it's gotten to the point where it's not if, it's when people will start dying because of these derailments. and as of right now, with congrees being the way it is, the only people that can stop it are the folks at the FRA.

Rant over.
Image
Old EMD’s are the gift that keeps on giving.

Post Reply