GDLK Operations

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Super Chief
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by Super Chief »

Since their inception they've used 2 road trains and a local to get a car from Elkhart to Grand Rapids assuming a local gets it to the final customer. 302 takes whole train to Kazoo. There a yard crew breaks it apart in Botsford and separates the cars for GR, the south local, and the Pfzier job. Also any cars for Graphic Packaging you could call a north local. As far as cars for customers between Kazoo and GR usually 303 switches both ways on a round trip. There is a rumor a new yard in Three Rivers along 131 could be in the works in the next 5 years. This would eliminate the auto congestion in Kazoo when all jobs are running around the wye at BO tower.

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justalurker66
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by justalurker66 »

What threw me off is 302 is listed as "Mon - Sat KZ-EK Turn; reported on duty time 0530" 102 is "Mon - Fri 302 recrew; 1100 start time" So Sunday Night/Monday Morning arriving Elkhart 1:20am (returning north at 5:40am) is .... what crew? Or are the scheduled runs so far out of normal?

When I see occupancy late at night (10pm to Midnight) I usually think it is the local - and in non-quarentimes I have made the run over to see what is happening and confirmed that the crew was dropping and swapping cars east (north) of CP 1 and west of Middleton Run Rd. Early this morning surprised me when CP 1 was cleared and GDLK made its appearance - four engines and a line of cars in to the yard and few hours later three engines and a line of cars back to Kalamazoo. (GDLK left an NS engine behind.)

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justalurker66
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by justalurker66 »

Super Chief wrote:There is a rumor a new yard in Three Rivers along 131 could be in the works in the next 5 years. This would eliminate the auto congestion in Kazoo when all jobs are running around the wye at BO tower.
I like that idea. I understand why GDLK would want to limit their trips to Elkhart to one a day (they can spend a lot of time waiting for a gap in Chicago Line traffic). Breaking the train somewhere on the GDLK makes sense.

Now if only GDLK can get NS to build the train in two segments (one for KZoo and one for GR). Light empties at the front and heavy loads at the back?

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SD80MAC
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by SD80MAC »

justalurker66 wrote: Light empties at the front and heavy loads at the back?
That sounds like a derailment or a broken knuckle waiting to happen! You always want your loads on the head end.
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dave989
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Re: GDLK Operations

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SD-40 4206 is pushing a ballast car towards 36th & Eastern Ave. in Kentwood. Dumping it now next to Eastern southeast.

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Ypsi
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by Ypsi »

Fot a car off of GRE it goes on 121, and is put into an NS block for 303/101. The 303/101 takes it to KAL where the train is sorted by the 100. 302 takes the car down. So 4 total trains touch a car going to or from GRE. As for random times, there is a night time “extra” crew who could get it, or the 100 crew could have been on. No extra board on GDLK presently.
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Plannerdad
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by Plannerdad »

Grand Elk just left Elkhart, per the railcam. 4 Engines, 40 cars, no center beam lumber cars.

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~Z~
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by ~Z~ »

dave989 wrote:SD-40 4206 is pushing a ballast car towards 36th & Eastern Ave. in Kentwood. Dumping it now next to Eastern southeast.
Thx Dave. Heard the horn as they were leaving eastern right about 12:30, checked the thread and saw this. So that's why they removed those 8 cars from storage, makes sense.
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justalurker66
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by justalurker66 »

SD80MAC wrote:
justalurker66 wrote: Light empties at the front and heavy loads at the back?
That sounds like a derailment or a broken knuckle waiting to happen! You always want your loads on the head end.
It was a dig at NS (and CSX). They seem to like to build trains with enough empties at the head end to stringline a curve.

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justalurker66
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Re: GDLK Operations

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Plannerdad wrote:Grand Elk just left Elkhart, per the railcam. 4 Engines, 40 cars, no center beam lumber cars.
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MQT1223
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by MQT1223 »

justalurker66 wrote:
Super Chief wrote:There is a rumor a new yard in Three Rivers along 131 could be in the works in the next 5 years. This would eliminate the auto congestion in Kazoo when all jobs are running around the wye at BO tower.
I like that idea. I understand why GDLK would want to limit their trips to Elkhart to one a day (they can spend a lot of time waiting for a gap in Chicago Line traffic). Breaking the train somewhere on the GDLK makes sense.

Now if only GDLK can get NS to build the train in two segments (one for KZoo and one for GR). Light empties at the front and heavy loads at the back?
That's not a rumor from what I've heard. Its supposed to go along most of the passing siding just north of Three Rivers from CP Park south just north of CP Cowling. GDLK wants to basically use Gearhart strictly for local and interchange work.
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PatAzo
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by PatAzo »

It would be interesting to see how the economics of building a yard in Three Rivers works out. How many tracks would they build and how long? Materials, grading and install it's $1M+ per mile to lay track. Throw in some land acquisition, engineering, lighting, some form of an office and five tracks holding 50 cars each plus the lead is over $3M.

If this isn't built to support new business the pay back has to come from savings. Assume WATCO is a long term thinker and they want a maximum of a 10 year pay back (that's generous). $3M over 10 years needs to save $300K per year. What does the Elk pay? Assuming a base wage of $50K per year a fully burdened worker would cost maybe $90K per year. Is the yard going to eliminate three people?

Kalamazoo and GR cars still have to be hauled north. They still have to flat switch everything. They still have movements in and out of Gerhart. They could eliminate 303's two reverse movements and 501 could work from Three Rivers but unless they can eliminate a crew completely it doesn't work.

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~Z~
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by ~Z~ »

Super Chief wrote:There is a rumor a new yard in Three Rivers along 131 could be in the works in the next 5 years. This would eliminate the auto congestion in Kazoo when all jobs are running around the wye at BO tower.
Yard at CP Park eh? This idea has been floating around for many years now, mostly posted by you, starting back in 2013 :)
A few threads with the idea:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=28028&p=281613&hili ... LK#p281613
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=30512&p=357816&hili ... LK#p357816
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=31059&p=336471&hil ... LK#p336471
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=29112&p=297340&hili ... LK#p297340
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GTW
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by GTW »

There is also a line relocation in Kalamazoo in the works if plans are to follow thru. That would be the removal of the GR&I diamond and moving all traffic over to the line at BO and reconecting somewhere north of BO.

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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by PatAzo »

GTW wrote:There is also a line relocation in Kalamazoo in the works if plans are to follow thru. That would be the removal of the GR&I diamond and moving all traffic over to the line at BO and reconecting somewhere north of BO.
That would be a project that would have legs under it if they got MDOT and the city to come on board. But with the budget shortfalls coming in state government the money might not be there.

I've wondered what the Elk's liability exposure is shoving 303 backward across roadways, particularly Kalamazoo Ave when the bar hoppers are out. If pedestrians can be run over with locomotive horns blaring, how hard would it be to do in the dark with just a conductor hollering look out.

Jim_c
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by Jim_c »

GTW wrote:There is also a line relocation in Kalamazoo in the works if plans are to follow thru. That would be the removal of the GR&I diamond and moving all traffic over to the line at BO and reconecting somewhere north of BO.
With the paper mill expansion at the old Checker Motors site, that would probably provide an excellent opportunity to reconnect. The current rail configuration will probably need to change anyway.
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David Lang
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by David Lang »

Seem like the most logical location for track consolidation is just south of Model Avenue where the line from Grand Rapids (old GR&I) could be tied into the existing track just to the East. This would eliminate the old GR&I from there, South across the Amtrak line all the way to Gib.

In my opinion, they could (or maybe should) also install a new set of crossovers (as part of this project) somewhere West of where the Amtrak Line crosses the Kalamazoo River and East of Harrison Street (really the only place where it could go), along with a wye from Amtrak's North Track to the "new" North-South Grand Elk line so trains can move to and from Gearhart and Grand Rapids without having to back up (which seems really inefficient actually). The Parking lot just to the Northeast of BO Tower would be affected, but I really don't see why that would be a big deal - make a new parking lot somewhere else.

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Saturnalia
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by Saturnalia »

As for replacing that parking lot, just do a land swap. They could easily turn the old ROW into a parking lot.
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David Lang
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Re: GDLK Operations

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Saturnalia wrote:
As for replacing that parking lot, just do a land swap. They could easily turn the old ROW into a parking lot.
Exactly.

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Jetlink
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Re: GDLK Operations

Unread post by Jetlink »

Stirring the pot some more here. Why not have it be a transfer in the north west quadrant, that way Amtrak could run to Grand Rapids and get the Pere Marquette off Pere Marquette as some have envisioned?
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