Napoleon, Defiance and Western: The Definitive Thread

[AARR]

7-8 but they may not start in Defiance

matt76 - If you don't see them in Defiance start driving toward Napoleon. Keep an eye on the tracks. You should eventually catch them somewhere.

[MagnumForce]

They may not start in Napoleon either. A lot goes to and from Woodburn now. Depending on your direction just start on 24 and go either east from Woodburn or West from Napoleon. Aside from in Defiance, Antwerp and Napoleon, the track is very visible from Parallel 4 lane US 24. You'll find them eventually.

[Y@]

3054 westbound between Okolona and Jewell with about 10 cars.

[jrgerber]

The MSO crews also probably operate both segments of the Elkhart and Western and probably the Kendallville operation as well. When Pioneer purchased the MSO it came with one of the Elkhart and Western and Kendallville operations as well. Also remember that at one time MSO crews were responsible for the West Michigan operation as well.

[AARR]

The MSO crews also probably operate both segments of the Elkhart and Western and probably the Kendallville operation as well. When Pioneer purchased the MSO it came with one of the Elkhart and Western and Kendallville operations as well. Also remember that at one time MSO crews were responsible for the West Michigan operation as well.

There are days the crew puts more miles on their car than on the train engine(s)

[MagnumForce]

ND&W has there own crews, they don't jump to thew MSO operations normally. Most of the guys came over from the MAW. The ND&W has as many as three crews working somedays, a much busier operation than the other MSO properties.

[matt76]

Caught this at Defiance and a couple miles west of Defiance on the way to Woodburn today. Track is in rough shape still but at least it's in service now.I have several other ND&W pics and will be posting more in the next few days on my flickr account. https://www.flickr.com/photos/mattditton1976/

[JStryker722]

Caught this at Defiance and a couple miles west of Defiance on the way to Woodburn today. Track is in rough shape still but at least it's in service now.I have several other ND&W pics and will be posting more in the next few days on my flickr account. https://www.flickr.com/photos/mattditton1976/

That track as more humps in it than a roller coaster lol
In all seriousness,second-hand straight track would do the line wonders.dont need new rail necessarily,just decent relay rail would do for now.

[Notch 8]

That track as more humps in it than a roller coaster lol
In all seriousness,second-hand straight track would do the line wonders.dont need new rail necessarily,just decent relay rail would do for now.

They did re-lay rail from the INER that they had pulled up several years ago when the INER did their rail replacement. It looks like they need to lay swamp ties and a bunch of ballast ! Pioneer has put more $$$$ in this property then anyone else for the last 50 plus years. How is the Lafarge traffic been this year ?

[matt76]

Pioneer has actually done quite a bit and they had crews working around Okolona yesterday. They've replaced ties, crossing signals and laid ballast. I would hate to see where this line would be if the previous owners still had it.

[JStryker722]

That track as more humps in it than a roller coaster lol
In all seriousness,second-hand straight track would do the line wonders.dont need new rail necessarily,just decent relay rail would do for now.

They did re-lay rail from the INER that they had pulled up several years ago when the INER did their rail replacement. It looks like they need to lay swamp ties and a bunch of ballast ! Pioneer has put more $$$$ in this property then anyone else for the last 50 plus years. How is the Lafarge traffic been this year ?

That must've been on the Defiance-Napoleon segment cuz it doesn't look like that did it in the above photos lol

[MagnumForce]

You are incredibly underestimating how bad the track was if you think nothing has been done to improve the line. Quite literally the last company to do any real maintenance to the line was the Wabash.

[MQT1223]

You are incredibly underestimating how bad the track was if you think nothing has been done to improve the line. Quite literally the last company to do any real maintenance to the line was the Wabash.

And the Wabash last existed independently in the mid-60's so for 50 years this line was neglected. A lot of time for the current conditions to set up.

[JStryker722]

You are incredibly underestimating how bad the track was if you think nothing has been done to improve the line. Quite literally the last company to do any real maintenance to the line was the Wabash.

And the Wabash last existed independently in the mid-60's so for 50 years this line was neglected. A lot of time for the current conditions to set up.

Oh my,I didn't think it been that long. Then yeah I agree at least they are reversing some of the neglect.

[midland sub]

We should also stress the Wabash maintained the line based on cars 70 tons or less.

[MQT1223]

We should also stress the Wabash maintained the line based on cars 70 tons or less.

What kind of stuff did the Wabash run back then on this line? I'm guessing things were on the downturn so they even they let the line go at somepoint.

[redside20]

We should also stress the Wabash maintained the line based on cars 70 tons or less.

What kind of stuff did the Wabash run back then on this line? I'm guessing things were on the downturn so they even they let the line go at somepoint.

Things like high speed passenger trains...way back when.

[MSchwiebert]

From a freight perspective the line was long a secondary route to the Toledo - Montpelier route. That route had the benefit of the interchanged auto parts traffic with the DT&I at Delta that the Fort Wayne - Toledo line did not. As for traffic sources during the Wabash days, with the exception of the tire plant at Woodburn and the older Manville plant in Defiance, it was the traditional "small town - occsional car" businesses (grain, fertilizer, coal, farm equipment deliveries). There was a circus loading TOFC ramp in Napoleon, but I'd be surprised if it ever saw use. Keep in mind that the Napoleon Industrial park didn't exist until the late 1970's, so there was no ADS tile (the predecessor to that was in Elery on the Clover Leaf) or the cold storage facilities. On the other hand there was some interchange traffic with the DT&I in Napoleon - mostly soda ash for Manville, but occasionally other things that wouldn't route well via Delta (an example of this in the N&W days was some long bridge beams that I'm sure wouldn't have gone down the ramp into Delta yard all that well!).

We should also stress the Wabash maintained the line based on cars 70 tons or less.

What kind of stuff did the Wabash run back then on this line? I'm guessing things were on the downturn so they even they let the line go at somepoint.

[JStryker722]

Would you say there is more business now on this line or less?

[MSchwiebert]

It's difficult to make an apples to apples comparision. On the plus side, ND&W has access to Systech/LaFarge at Cecil (the Wabash did not), and there's the business that exist in the Napoleon Industrial park that were not there during Wabash days. On the minus side, NS kept the access to the tire plant at Woodburn, there's no carload coal or farm implement shipments anymore, and the DT&I interchange traffic is long gone. I'd call Defiance a wash, as would be the fertlizer etc.

Would you say there is more business now on this line or less?